OFFICIAL TRANSCRIPT OF COUNTY PSYCHOLOGIST DR. ALLEN OSWALD WITH PATIENT BRAD NAVARROR, CASE #MN449704, JUNE 7, 1:30 PM.
DOCTOR OSWALD: Now that summer is here, our bi-weekly sessions have begun. How have you been?
BRAD: I’m still not happy about this whole probation thing.
DOCTOR OSWALD: You shouldn’t be. It’s a punishment. You have a tan – have you gotten outside in the sun recently?
BRAD: No, not really.
DOCTOR OSWALD: Then let’s get started. I want to talk deeper about why fire fascinates you.
BRAD: I’ve already answered that question.
DOCTOR OSWALD: No, you’ve avoided it every time I’ve brought it up.
BRAD: Turn the recorder off.
DOCTOR OSWALD: By law, I can’t turn it off as long as you’re in this room alone with me.
BRAD: Then forget about an honest answer or conversation, and forget getting to know the real me.
DOCTOR OSWALD: Then you forget about getting off probation.
BRAD: Why is it so important for you to know the real me?
DOCTOR OSWALD: Because I want to help you bury your past. Only then can I help you build a new future.
BRAD: But I told you, I didn’t do anything wrong here.
DOCTOR OSWALD: Stop pretending everything is OK. You’re on probation, and may be going to prison, and you’ve lost the power to control your life. We have to focus on fixing your life one issue at a time.
BRAD: This is why I hide from people like you. You can force me to come to your office, but you can’t force me to become somebody I don’t want to be.
DOCTOR OSWALD: This conversation isn’t going as I planned. Let’s take a minute to collect our thoughts and resume.
DOCTOR OSWALD: Let’s look at this from a different angle. Tell me about your social life. Your teachers say you’re struggling in their classrooms, and your mother says you don’t have any real friends. Do you agree with these assessments?
BRAD: Why are you asking me these questions? My social life doesn’t have anything to do with the reason I’m here.
DOCTOR OSWALD: I want to talk about it because I want to understand you. I’ve asked other teachers about you, and I’ve learned that fellow students bullied you severely all last year, especially after the fire. People who know you think you’ve fallen into a deep depression. Is this true?
BRAD: I’m not depressed.
DOCTOR OSWALD: When was the last time you felt good about yourself?
BRAD: The moment before I walked in this room and had to see you.
DOCTOR OSWALD: I called your mother before you arrived. She said you argued with her this morning − that you were extremely angry about something.
BRAD: You called her?
DOCTOR OSWALD: It’s my job to understand the source of your issues. I’m always trying to learn more about you. If you won’t talk to me, I’ll do my research elsewhere. Take down your guard, Brad. It’s OK to admit your life isn’t the greatest right now. Speak the truth. The truth can set you free from this nightmare.
BRAD: Don’t push me. I have friends.
DOCTOR OSWALD: How do you handle the bullying? Real friends make you stronger, not weaker.
BRAD: Don’t tell me how to live my life. You don’t know anything about me.
DOCTOR OSWALD: I know you’re a little different than everyone else, and it could be in a good way. I think you’re stronger than most people think. Maybe even stronger than you realize.
BRAD: I’m warning you; leave me alone.
DOCTOR OSWALD: Or what? You’re going to run away? I’ll call the police and have a warrant issued in minutes. You won’t get anywhere by running from your problems.
BRAD: You’re the one who said I was smart a few weeks ago. Stop taunting me like I’m a caged animal.
DOCTOR OSWALD: Wow, you remembered when I called you smart? Now I know you’re listening to me even if you don’t act like it. Keep sharing with me and we might get somewhere together. Our time today is coming to an end, but I want to read an old document I found in your file before you go. It’s the testimony of the court’s psychiatrist the day your initial custody was decided. It reads:
In my expert opinion, based on 30 years working in the field of juvenile criminal psychological evaluations, Bradley M. Navarro should be classified in the highest risk-category for juvenile offenders. I find ample evidence showing that Mr. Navarro should be incarcerated for a significant period of time. In my years of advising courts on how to proceed with such offenders, I have witnessed much less-severe cases get sentenced to much longer periods of incarceration. But because of all the legal maneuvering that his family’s attorney has done, it is possible that Bradley M. Navarro will never do any time incarcerated, which is absurd for this high-profile crime. A young person of this age, who has shown repeated premeditation to carry out similar crimes, is almost never mature enough to comprehend the harm that he has caused himself and the community. I believe Bradley M. Navarro, as long as he continues to deny his involvement, and show a complete lack of remorse, will no doubt return to such behavior when he is released into society again. If our criminal justice system decides to release him following this initial appearance, it would be making a great mistake, in my opinion.
DOCTOR OSWALD: What do you think?
DOCTOR OSWALD: Do you think this doctor’s opinion is true?
DOCTOR OSWALD: I want to know your thoughts.
BRAD: That man never knew me. We were in a room together for 30 minutes. He asked me some dumb questions and walked out on me. He believed whatever he wanted to believe.
DOCTOR OSWALD: Does anyone know the real you?
BRAD: Yeah, someone does.
DOCTOR OSWALD: Who?
BRAD: Never mind. It’s time for me to go.
DOCTOR OSWALD: Yes, I also have a meeting to get to, but before I leave, I want to apologize to you for calling you weak. You’re not weak. I now realize you’re just like I am; you want control. You want things your way. I’m guessing that’s why you enjoy fire. It gives you the control you can’t find anywhere else.
RECORDING STOPS JUNE 7 – 2:30 PM